Jennik Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 Hi Brian Wondering if you can help with some guidance on shooting in low light with no flash Ive got some photos which i think are sharp (Damien doesnt concur) and have lots of noise. so once i remove the noise (as per Damiens instruction) it goes really soft and then Damien says they are unusable. Im a bit stuck as to what I am doing wrong. surely there are low light photos with lots of noise that are still usable. I did some band shots last weekend and ISO was at 6400 but I can see what will happen is once I edit them, they will go too soft and become unusable....... Thanks for your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Symonds Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 Brian will need to see examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Symonds Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 Also, I figure he'll need to know about your gear - camera and lenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 Yep, need examples, gear/lens info and what shutter speed / aperture / ISO used on the example photos Also, were you in the pit or further back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted September 27, 2018 Author Share Posted September 27, 2018 Thanks Brian Sony A7ii FE 55mm F1.8 ZA 1/320 2.8 6400 in the pit ive edited this one (though I know Damien will more than likely think its sh*t) i got rid of some of the noise but not all of it Ill send through another example soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted September 27, 2018 Author Share Posted September 27, 2018 1/400 2.8 6400 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted September 27, 2018 Share Posted September 27, 2018 Can I see the original photos before noise reduction? Because there seems to be multiple things going on. Same photos are fine, I want to see no noise reduction and no sharpening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted September 27, 2018 Author Share Posted September 27, 2018 i removed the noise and sharpening that is added in RAW no editing on these Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Yeah, I can see the noise, though it's not THAT BAD. I agree with Damien, these photos are not Tack-Sharp. The Bass player photo is slightly salvageable, but with A LOT of help from PS and only to be viewed small on social media. It's not going to end up in your portfolio and I'd personally keep is small if posting on Social Media. Let's start with the Bass Player photo. From what I can tell, the camera locked focus on the word "Ride," since it seems to be a tad sharper than the rest of the photo. Or your lens is back-focusing slightly. There isn't enough of contrast swing on the eye and the light on his face is making the camera struggle. I would check your settings and make sure your camera is set to "Focus Priority" (or equivalent) instead of "Release." (or equivalent) Meaning, you will only be able to take the photo when the camera thinks things are in focus. Of course, you will end up on fighting your camera when it doesn't want to engage the shutter because it thinks things aren't in focus and that will result in missed shots. Which then folks will want it set to the other way, but that results in blurry, unusable photos. I'd rather have a noisy tack-sharp photo than a blurry one. The noise is typical for ISO 6400, and no matter what forum or review site or DxO score talks about your camera ISO 6400 is still 6400 and you aren't going to get the same results as if you shot at ISO 200 or whatever. Of course, sensors who capture at ISO 6400 are getting better, these photos remind me of shots taken with my D300s at around ISO 1600-2000. Now let's talk about f/2.8. The f/2.8 aperture will bite you, resulting in a DoF problem rather than a focus problem. f/3.2 is a lot more forgiving, so is f/4, and I know you didn't want to go above ISO 6400, but dropping your Shutter Speed isn't practical either. Especially if you are getting bumped while shooting in the Pit. Which takes us to the group photo... From what I can tell, your lens is back-focusing again. The only thing I can see that's sharp are the edges of the lights above the drummer; specifically, the gold/yellow light above the woman's head. That's in focus. Even the Microphone Stand over the drummer is more in focus than the people out front. At this point, I'd review your camera's settings, make sure that it doesn't try to use another auto-focus point if it can't lock focus. YOU want 100% control in situations like this. The camera will always take the easy way out. I'm wondering if there is some setting that needs to be changed. The other thing is to try using a different lens and see if you get better results. Especially in low-light situations like this. Your lens might need to be tweaked and hopefully your camera has a Auto Focus Fine-Tune. Anyway before we get ahead of ourselves, read your camera's manual and go over your autofocus settings. Try a different lens. Use f/2.8, f/3.2, f/5.6, etc. Learn your gear. You might find out that your lens is crap at 1.8, 2.8 and works best at f/4 or f/5.6. Or it's crap when people are more than 15 feet away and works perfectly if they are 5-10 feet away. I've had lenses like this. When I shot with a Crop Body and used my 17-55 f/2.8, photos were Tack-Sharp when the subject was 5-12 feet away and was "Ok" at 13-15 feet. As soon as they were 16-20 feet away, focus was soft and then I was reaching for my 70-200. I know you are going to be wanting to shoot at f/2.8 due to the light during musical performances. Which at that point you have two options: Send it in for repair and have it adjusted or buy a new (and better) lens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 1, 2018 Author Share Posted October 1, 2018 Thanks so much Brian for your response. The manual is this small crappy book which gives me nothing but I bought one through ibooks and thats helped me through alot. The focus was always on the face. I dont use back button focus on my camera and have no idea if its on, there are so many settings on this camera its a bit overwhelming. Ive read a few forums and seems people have similar issues with focus on this camera and the book talks about how the focus system is very complex......seems my nikon d90 was much easier! Do I need to make sure something like this is enabled in the video? Is this the right direction? Ill do some more research on all the settings and see how i go i used my 35mm also but they were not as good so I havent bothered with any of those. What sort of things further do I need in PS? Also what size is good for social media? I know these are not that great but I still need to give them to the client. Feeling like a newb!!! but im here to learn and take in all the help you guys are giving me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 That video goes really fast, but yes, this is the right direction. I saw a AF-C which is for moving subjects. I just need to figure out how to lock in the AF point. The problem is that there wasn’t enough contrast swing for the camera to lock on. Eyeballs from 20 feet away in crappy light is tough for any camera. I’m sure you are not on a single-point AF mode and on some auto mode, meaning you select the AF point, but the camera will pick something better if it can’t lock on. Personally, I’ve never touched a Sony camera. I might move this thread to the Land of Misfits after reading some manuals about the focus modes and still can’t figure things out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 1, 2018 Author Share Posted October 1, 2018 Great thanks Brian, good place for me to start anyway. Thanks for your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Alright, I watched the video. It's still very fast, but I think that demonstration is what your camera is doing. It's trying to lock on the eye of the subject, where you probably put the AF point, but they move or turn their heads slightly and the camera goes hunting for a better target. You are really going to have to figure out all the AF modes on your camera. AF-C is a starting point, I'm just not sure about the other settings. We want you to make all the decisions and not the camera. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 Thanks Brian between animals and live gigs pics I'm coming out with a lot less happy images than I did with my D90 so I'll work on it! Thanks for your responses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 8, 2018 Author Share Posted October 8, 2018 Brian this was in the manual, reading through them, testing them all, watching lots of youtube clips, im still not leaning towards one way that is better. the more i practise, the less shots im getting that are sharp lol..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 Flexible Spot Lock On AF (Bottom One) is the one that gives you the most control. That said, the camera can still pick something easier to lock on. It doesn't seem to have a focus mode like what is on a Canon or Nikon body. In a nutshell, I'm not liking your choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 8, 2018 Share Posted October 8, 2018 The Nikon D810, D850 are awesome for Concert Photography. I'm sure a Canon 5D Mark III and Canon 5D Mark IV are also decent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 8, 2018 Author Share Posted October 8, 2018 ye the camera still picks something which doesnt work...... but even when it does the focus isnt always right and it can be fiddly changing the focus point - delaying and then missing the shot.....feel im better off doing a centre focus that doesnt move? what about using my D90 or you think the technology is too old now? all these pics were done on the D90......these are probably around 7 years old, my first practise shots in band photography so please forgive whatever isnt right about them! https://jennik.zenfolio.com/p753116439 I had my eye on the D810 for many years now but ended up buying the Sony for travelling as I didnt think I was going to try get clients but many years on I know thats what I want to do. I did a firmware update and reset factory settings (as this helped someone on a forum) hoping that might help a tad otherwise I guess i start saving my pennies for a new one... thanks for all your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Your D90 is too old at this point. It falls apart above ISO 800. Not a good thing in clubs and concert venues The D850 is amazing, but raw files are HUGE due to the 45MP. Plus the D850 has been on back-order in the US forever. The D810 isn’t bad either. Either case, the technology is light years ahead of your D90. Nikon is trying to kill stock so the D810 has instant rebates. Keep in mind, there are lenses to buy, memory cards to buy, extra batteries and other odds and ends Heck, I’m thinking you could pickup a Used D700 from Keh.com. The D700 uses the same batteries and such as your D90 and all you would need is CF cards and full frame glass. D700 bodies go for about $800 right about now. Oh, if you are wondering about the D750, great sensor. Produces great images. Build quality is crap and it has had multiple recalls over the years. I really wish they would put a D750 sensor in a D810 body, but that’s not going to happen. Nikon is all Mirrorless Happy with their new Z-Line release. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 9, 2018 Author Share Posted October 9, 2018 OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!! :-) well i already have full frame glass cause i knew one day i would buy a full frame nikon ill look into it, thanks Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 $648 for a “EX Rating” D700 https://www.keh.com/shop/nikon-d700-12-1-megapixel-digital-slr-camera-body-only.html The D700 is decent up to ISO 6400. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 9, 2018 Share Posted October 9, 2018 Oh, if you do get a D700, pickup a couple of these: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1003355-REG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 9, 2018 Author Share Posted October 9, 2018 Thanks Brian, Im going to sell my Sony and buy something a bit newer, perhaps a D810 or the new A7iii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 10, 2018 Share Posted October 10, 2018 Before buying anything.... Download the Sony A7iii manual and give it a read. If the focusing system is similar / has the same choices, then it doesn't do you any good by upgrading to a Sony A7iii. What Nikon FX Glass do you have? The D810 / D850 is quite demanding and requires the best glass to yield the best results. So let me know what lenses you plan on using/own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennik Posted October 10, 2018 Author Share Posted October 10, 2018 What is the focusing mode you said the Sony didn't seem to have compared to the canon Nikon? 50mm 1.4, 28mm 1.8, tamron 90mm 2.8 macro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now